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Jeppesen Charts....On the Way Out
Posted: Sat Sep 29, 2007 9:15 pm
by nwadc10
"When I got to the crew room the other day and checked my company mailbox I found an unpleasant surprise. Jeppesen charts are on the way out, we are switching to a product by Luftansa Systems called LIDO charts. I received an informational packet with chart legends and example charts. If any of you have real experience with LIDO charts feel free to way in. There is one chart that I do like which is an overview of all SIDs and STARs on one page which is nice for planning purposes. The approach charts resemble the old style of Jepp charts with information scattered about the page. The new Jepp format put the data in an easy to read and brief chart with important notes all in one standard place....not so with LIDO charts. I'm trying to keep an open mind about the switch but with what I've seen so far it's a step backwards from Jepp charts. Justin"
Posted: Sat Sep 29, 2007 11:32 pm
by yoni63
"So are Jepp charts on the way out period? or downsizing, or do you know? That's wierd Jeppeson has been around since peanut butter! Found a link in regard to the Lido charts. Go to this page, at the very very bottom is a search window, type in charts and you can browse different topic about the Lido charts.
http://www.lhsystems.com/index.htm"
Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 1:35 am
by 1691
"Dont throw out your Jepps. We had Lido charts at JetBlue (where I work) and the pilots absolutely hated them. They were missing several crossing restrictions, as well as other things. Oh yeah, it seemed that every chart was double folded. The Lido charts look cooler, but the Jeppesen products are a better fit, and better quality."
Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 1:36 am
by Craig Applegate 1207
"I don't know much about the LIDO charts, but i believe that is a apart of the LIDO Flight Planning System which some carriers us to do their flight planning. Atlas/Polar was looking into the LIDO System for our use but we are going with an outfit called Flugwerkzeuge or F:WZ. We hope to start using this new system by end of 1st QTR next year."
Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 6:57 am
by Brogs
Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 11:25 am
by nwadc10
"After reading more on our company forum the reason we are changing is because we needed new software/computer system for the Delta flying the company is starting in December. Luftansa systems was a bidder and they threw in these LIDO charts for free...done deal. I saw mentioned that FedEx uses LIDO charts as well. The picture above is the only chart I think is an improvement so far. It's an overview showing all departures and arrivals into the airport on one chart. Of course reference the actual SID/STAR chart to fly it. But for planning purposes it looks good. I also read that most airports that my airline flies to haven't been produced into chart form yet. Luftansa better be busy making those tho there are so many I fear quality and/or accuracy will suffer. I can see this being a big mess. The company has provided a CBT with up to 80 hrs worth of information that I have yet to go thru. Maybe I will feel better about these charts when I finish that. Did JetBlue get rid of LIDO or did they switch back? I'll keep an eye out for missing info. As it stands now, Captain's start using LIDO on the line mid-november and FO's will continue w/ Jepp until January. And of course I wouldn't throw out my Jepps...they will be my FS charts now
"
Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 11:43 am
by yoni63
"
Mike, Ingrid is no big deal, she might be nice, but she has some hang ups... It was ok, but nothing to write home about..
"
Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 11:30 pm
by esurfman
"Justin, I would buy the Jeppesen charts from your company when they are finished with them. If they ever want to get rid of them.
"
Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 6:43 am
by 1691
"
"nwadc10" wrote:After reading more on our company forum the reason we are changing is because we needed new software/computer system for the Delta flying the company is starting in December. Luftansa systems was a bidder and they threw in these LIDO charts for free...done deal. I saw mentioned that FedEx uses LIDO charts as well. The picture above is the only chart I think is an improvement so far. It's an overview showing all departures and arrivals into the airport on one chart. Of course reference the actual SID/STAR chart to fly it. But for planning purposes it looks good. I also read that most airports that my airline flies to haven't been produced into chart form yet. Luftansa better be busy making those tho there are so many I fear quality and/or accuracy will suffer. I can see this being a big mess. The company has provided a CBT with up to 80 hrs worth of information that I have yet to go thru. Maybe I will feel better about these charts when I finish that. Did JetBlue get rid of LIDO or did they switch back? I'll keep an eye out for missing info. As it stands now, Captain's start using LIDO on the line mid-november and FO's will continue w/ Jepp until January. And of course I wouldn't throw out my Jepps...they will be my FS charts now
JetBlue got rid of them because the pilot group disliked them so much. From what I was told they were missing some critical crossing and speed restrictions published (or not published) and we were close to getting fined a bunch of times as a result. Requests for revisions would have taken up to 2 cycles, so they just went back to Jepp."
Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 7:46 am
by Brogs
"
"yoni63" wrote: Mike, Ingrid is no big deal, she might be nice, but she has some hang ups... It was ok, but nothing to write home about..
In your dreams Buddy !
"
Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 10:51 am
by yoni63
She did have nice blue eyes tho...
Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2007 9:09 pm
by nwadc10
Posted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 6:36 pm
by phil747fan
Justin,
sorry to wake up this old post ...
the lido form is nothing new under the sun in fact this is the new as it was in use with ATLAS group not the company (ATLAS was Air France, Sabena, Lufthansa, Iberia Alitalia and some others formed to buy aircrafts like 747, DC10 in same engine and cockpit design) they worked too on Charts and Maps i ve some in French used by UTA (KSSU group but not for 747 ops they were with air france due to DGAC (french FAA)) so they re good to sell or give something not new as a user i prefer jeppesen ..
see you
Phil
Posted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 7:40 pm
by nwadc10
Now that the captains have been actively using LIDO for about two months...most still hate them. The biggest reason (setting aside the occasional dangerously inaccurate chart) is that they just plain aren't user friendly. Every chart is so large that they are folded. Why they felt charts had to be to scale is beyond me. The people using them are professional pilots, we can figure out the chart if it isn't to scale. A revision was sent out a couple weeks ago and a couple days later we got a notice to pay attention to the revised pages. Why? Because some pages in the *revision* were older than the chart they were intended to revise. Pure ameteur production and highly unimpressive operation by LIDO. It's not funny when our livelyhood/life/certificate is on the line when we use these charts. Oh well...behold the almighty dollar, that's why we changed in the first place.
With that said, there are a few nice things about LIDO however the cons outway the pros. I heard a rumor a day or two ago that we may switch back to Jepp. That's just it though, it's only a rumor. I still have Jepps but on the last transition schedule from a couple months ago, I will be switching to LIDO in a few weeks.
Posted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 1:53 am
by hawkeyeted
You have no idea how many times I had to re-read this to make sure I was seeing "LIDO" and not "LIBIDO".
Makes one wonder where my head is at.......
