Erica, I dont know if you flew on vatsim or not, but vatsim weather can cause those weird crosswinds on landiings. You can switch it off as you decend.
I went to active sky 6, much better weather program, and more stable too.
congrats on the flight.
ed
Longest flight?
Moderators: Staff, HR, Flight Ops
-
cyoo eddie
Re: Longest flight?
Justin, thanks for the tip, I will definatly check those error logs next time. However some of my computer crashes were due to real world weather
around here, we have been having quite a few thunderstorms around the Toronto area this year. All it takes is for they hydro to flicker once, and
your flight is no more....
very annoying.... 
around here, we have been having quite a few thunderstorms around the Toronto area this year. All it takes is for they hydro to flicker once, and
your flight is no more....
very annoying.... -
Erica Benedikty
Re: Longest flight?
Yes, I did the flight on vatsim and with Active sky 6.5. It could be Squawk box 4 that was causing the issue, I will have to check and make sure that vatsim weather is disabled. When I went into the menu during flight to find out why it was not beeping when atc or someone was talking to me, it disconnected my auto throttle and caused an overspeed. After that I didn't want to touch anything as I was reading in their forums about SB4 causing CTD, I guess that's why the call it a public beta though. As for power, I would recommend a battery backup, it doesn't need to be a big one that will power Nasa, mine is about $60 or so (UPS650, I think). All I have is the computer plugged into it (no monitors) and it will only stay on with the computer running for about 5 min before it powers everything down safely. Sometimes that is all you need, I've had the power go out for seconds, which would normally ruin you day in a long haul flight. When the power came back on, the flight was still going. I did have to reconnect to vatsim of course.
See you in the skies... maybe tomorrow
-
1691
- Member with over 30 posts
- Posts: 1059
- Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2007 8:36 am
- Location: Long Island, NY
- Contact:
Re: Longest flight?
I have the same issue with SB4 as well. Im sure its one of those things that they are working on. From reading their forums, I can see that there have been several issues like this.
Allan Burek-1691
Coordinator, Aircraft Maintenance Operations
mx@globecargova.org
Live Flight Deck Camera
Coordinator, Aircraft Maintenance Operations
mx@globecargova.org
Live Flight Deck Camera
Re: Longest flight?
Alright, I'm well established in the cruise so I'll post about my flight planning. I spent over 6 hours between last night and this morning just coming up with the city pair. I opted for FGSL-YPAD. There is a key reason why I choose a city pair along this great circle route as you will see as I recap the steps I took to plan my flight. Keep in mind that my planning may not be correct and/or the only way to do it but it's what I did.
The biggest time consuming task wasn't finding city pairs, it was checking those city pairs for compliance with legal fuel requirements. This meant I had to find a re-release airport (RRAPT), do a flight plan from the departure to the RRAPT and another from the RRAPT to the destination. I did encounter some confusion in the fuel planning that I'll discuss later.
Here are a few city pairs that I considered and checked for legality:
FACT-NVVV
FACT-NFTF
FACT-PKMJ
FACT-PTPN
FACT-NSTU
FGSL-YBBN
FGSL-YPAD ***File Route***
FGSL-YMML
Each of the above pairings resulted in 3 flight plans and fuel calculations ( Dep-RRAPT, RRAPT-Dest, Dep-Dest). Before I discuss that, here's the secret to why I chose a city pair that traverses the Indian Ocean:
Notice the nice tailwind for much of the flight. An issue/concern I have though is that I'm afraid FS won't get access to this information and my actual winds aloft will be much lighter based on the nearest ground based winds aloft data in textual format. FSBuild planned the flights with what appears to be the much lighter winds.
Fuel Planning:
There are a few legal requirements we need to consider when planning our fuel. This flight plan distance is only 7576nm which is far shorter than the 744 can fly until the tanks are empty. Thankfully we have these fuel requirements so that nobody tries this or even accidentally attempts to fly as far as the airplane can actually fly.
We need enough fuel to fly from the departure airport to the destination, plus 10% of that fuel burn, then fly to the most distant alternate (sometimes 2 alternates are required) and from there hold 1,500 feet above the alternate airport for 30 minutes.
One trick to allow greater payload and/or to extend the legal range/endurance of the flight is to add a re-release airport (RRAPT) to the flight plan by manipulating the 10% fuel rule. The flight is initially released to an intermediate point. For my flight plan I used YPPH as the RRAPT, however the Point of Rerelease (POR) is usually a fix rather than an airport (an airport was used here because FSBuild can't plan to anything other than an airport). The term Rerelease Airport in reality is moreso an enroute alternate that the flight will divert to if sufficient fuel is not on the airplane at the POR to make it to the final destination of YPAD in my case.
Let's take a look at the numbers to see the advantage of using a re-release type flight plan. First, we'll look at a flight plan from FGSL to YPAD, the route without being re-released. The planned ETE is 15:25 of which we need to add fuel to fly 10% of that time. Fuel burn is 329543 of which 10% of that is 32954. With the 10% rule we'd need to have on board the aircraft at brake release (block out), 362497 lbs (329543+32954). That already exceeds the fuel capacity of the PMDG 744F by about 2000lbs. We haven't even accounted for fuel to alternate and hold for 30 minutes.
Now, let's see how re-releasing this flight at YPPH will help us stay legal and still get to our destination. Our fuel burn from FGSL-YPPH is 260212 lbs. With 10% fuel we'd need 286233 lbs to dispatch to YPPH which is what we are doing. However, we plan to add much more fuel so we can continue beyond YPPH to get to YPAD. The burn from YPPH to YPAD is 46335 lbs. With 10% we would need 50968 lbs. for dispatch from YPPH to YPAD. Where this trick really comes together is when you get re-released. You now get to move the excess 10% fuel from FGSL-YPPH that you didn't use into useable fuel for the remainder of the flight. Here's how the math works: 10% of the fuel burn from FGSL-YPPH is 26021 and 10% of YPPH-YPAD is 4633. The difference is 21388 which you can move from "legally extra" fuel to fuel you can actually burn when planning this on paper. Roughly, that allows us to fly an hour longer and still be legal with the 10% rule. Hypothetically, if we don't burn the 10% fuel, in the first example we'd need to land with 32954 lbs of fuel which comes only from the extra we have to carry due to the 10% rule. In the second, re-release example, we would land with 4633 lbs of fuel extra due to 10%. In the real world, that reduction in legally required extra fuel would be traded for higher payload (add payload until the heavier weight burns that excess fuel to go the same distance). In this competition we are trading it for addition distance/endurance.
Keep in mind these things: the 10% fuel, reserve, alternate, and holding for 30 minutes can all be burned if it needs to be. The flight plan on paper must account for all these things but doesn't mean you can't burn the extra fuel while enroute to the destination. The big caveat with flight planning for FS is that most (none that I know of actually but I haven't seen all) flight planners don't accomodate a Point of Re-release. For us, that means that when we plan a re-release flight plan we have to plan to the re-release airport then we have to plan a takeoff and climb out of that re-release airport. A real re-release begins at a fix already at the filed Flight Level and doesn't need to go over the RRAPT.
Here is my filed flight plan. Notice the fuel doesn't look like it's legal because the flight plan I'm operating off of is the direct FGSL-YPAD which on paper here isn't of the re-release type. I did work out the re-release data manually using the two other flight plans, FGSL-YPPH and YPPH-YPAD.
As I finish writing this, I just passed 2047S at 10 minutes early and 0.2k lbs more fuel than planned. EFOA to YPAD is 32.4
I really didn't add any details about the other fuel required for the flight plan because flight planners already take care of that for you.
Update:
I am approaching my POR of 32S02. I recalculated the flight plan with current winds and here is that new flight plan:
Notice that the fuel required for the re-release is now 83.0 while it was 95.1 on the original release. I will cross 32S02 with 89.9 which is above the re-release fuel so I can legally continue to YPAD.
This flight is working out well and little to no fuel issues. Let's look at a flight where we expect to cross 32S02 with 81.0 FOB. Normally we would automatically divert to YPPH because we can't legally be re-released to YPAD (FOB is less than re-release FOB). However there's one more trick we have up our sleeves thanks to the re-release flight plan.
For flights longer than 6 hours a destination alternate is required, regardless of weather conditions. When we departed FGSL to our RRAPT (YPPH) the flight was over 6 hours so we had to include an alternate of YPAG. At the re-release point, from RRAPT to YPAD, the ETE is approximately 3:30 which of course is less than 6 hours. We are no longer required to have an alternate as long as the weather is at least from 1 hour prior to 1 hour after our ETA: 2000' ceiling and 3 SM visibility. In the aviation world this is the "123 rule".
Let's look at the current METAR and TAF for YPAD to see if we can dump the alternate.
Wow, that's great weather. According to the 123 rule we no longer need an alternate.
When we departed FGSL we had on board 4878 lbs of fuel set aside to fly to our alternate. On the re-release flight plan we can move that 4878 lbs in alternate fuel to burnable fuel. The result is lowering the re-release fuel. Remember, the re-release fuel is enough fuel to fly to the destination, plus 10%, then fly to the most distant alternate and hold for 30 minutes. Here we are able to get rid of the fuel required to fly to the most distant alternate.
Now our re-release fuel would be 78.2 rather than 83.0. As you can see, crossing 32S02 with 81.0 FOB is now above the re-release fuel and we can continue, legally, to YPAD. Without using this trick of removing the alternate our re-release fuel would still be 83.0, above our actual FOB, we'd divert to YPPH.
You can see that this is just a numbers game played on paper.
I am planning to add re-relese capability to GCFM (the next generation of GCP) that will add a lot of realism and enhance the enjoyment of operating international flights.
Done:
I landed with 21053 lbs of fuel and for planning purposes I should have landed with no less than 12833 (10% from YPPH-YPAD, and 30 minutes of holding). Looks like the flight was a success.
Fly safe!
The biggest time consuming task wasn't finding city pairs, it was checking those city pairs for compliance with legal fuel requirements. This meant I had to find a re-release airport (RRAPT), do a flight plan from the departure to the RRAPT and another from the RRAPT to the destination. I did encounter some confusion in the fuel planning that I'll discuss later.
Here are a few city pairs that I considered and checked for legality:
FACT-NVVV
FACT-NFTF
FACT-PKMJ
FACT-PTPN
FACT-NSTU
FGSL-YBBN
FGSL-YPAD ***File Route***
FGSL-YMML
Each of the above pairings resulted in 3 flight plans and fuel calculations ( Dep-RRAPT, RRAPT-Dest, Dep-Dest). Before I discuss that, here's the secret to why I chose a city pair that traverses the Indian Ocean:
- FL340 Winds/Temps Aloft for 00Z. The red line is my approximate flight path.
- ApproxFP.GIF (199.68 KiB) Viewed 1937 times
Fuel Planning:
There are a few legal requirements we need to consider when planning our fuel. This flight plan distance is only 7576nm which is far shorter than the 744 can fly until the tanks are empty. Thankfully we have these fuel requirements so that nobody tries this or even accidentally attempts to fly as far as the airplane can actually fly.
We need enough fuel to fly from the departure airport to the destination, plus 10% of that fuel burn, then fly to the most distant alternate (sometimes 2 alternates are required) and from there hold 1,500 feet above the alternate airport for 30 minutes.
One trick to allow greater payload and/or to extend the legal range/endurance of the flight is to add a re-release airport (RRAPT) to the flight plan by manipulating the 10% fuel rule. The flight is initially released to an intermediate point. For my flight plan I used YPPH as the RRAPT, however the Point of Rerelease (POR) is usually a fix rather than an airport (an airport was used here because FSBuild can't plan to anything other than an airport). The term Rerelease Airport in reality is moreso an enroute alternate that the flight will divert to if sufficient fuel is not on the airplane at the POR to make it to the final destination of YPAD in my case.
Let's take a look at the numbers to see the advantage of using a re-release type flight plan. First, we'll look at a flight plan from FGSL to YPAD, the route without being re-released. The planned ETE is 15:25 of which we need to add fuel to fly 10% of that time. Fuel burn is 329543 of which 10% of that is 32954. With the 10% rule we'd need to have on board the aircraft at brake release (block out), 362497 lbs (329543+32954). That already exceeds the fuel capacity of the PMDG 744F by about 2000lbs. We haven't even accounted for fuel to alternate and hold for 30 minutes.
Now, let's see how re-releasing this flight at YPPH will help us stay legal and still get to our destination. Our fuel burn from FGSL-YPPH is 260212 lbs. With 10% fuel we'd need 286233 lbs to dispatch to YPPH which is what we are doing. However, we plan to add much more fuel so we can continue beyond YPPH to get to YPAD. The burn from YPPH to YPAD is 46335 lbs. With 10% we would need 50968 lbs. for dispatch from YPPH to YPAD. Where this trick really comes together is when you get re-released. You now get to move the excess 10% fuel from FGSL-YPPH that you didn't use into useable fuel for the remainder of the flight. Here's how the math works: 10% of the fuel burn from FGSL-YPPH is 26021 and 10% of YPPH-YPAD is 4633. The difference is 21388 which you can move from "legally extra" fuel to fuel you can actually burn when planning this on paper. Roughly, that allows us to fly an hour longer and still be legal with the 10% rule. Hypothetically, if we don't burn the 10% fuel, in the first example we'd need to land with 32954 lbs of fuel which comes only from the extra we have to carry due to the 10% rule. In the second, re-release example, we would land with 4633 lbs of fuel extra due to 10%. In the real world, that reduction in legally required extra fuel would be traded for higher payload (add payload until the heavier weight burns that excess fuel to go the same distance). In this competition we are trading it for addition distance/endurance.
Keep in mind these things: the 10% fuel, reserve, alternate, and holding for 30 minutes can all be burned if it needs to be. The flight plan on paper must account for all these things but doesn't mean you can't burn the extra fuel while enroute to the destination. The big caveat with flight planning for FS is that most (none that I know of actually but I haven't seen all) flight planners don't accomodate a Point of Re-release. For us, that means that when we plan a re-release flight plan we have to plan to the re-release airport then we have to plan a takeoff and climb out of that re-release airport. A real re-release begins at a fix already at the filed Flight Level and doesn't need to go over the RRAPT.
Here is my filed flight plan. Notice the fuel doesn't look like it's legal because the flight plan I'm operating off of is the direct FGSL-YPAD which on paper here isn't of the re-release type. I did work out the re-release data manually using the two other flight plans, FGSL-YPPH and YPPH-YPAD.
Code: Select all
FSBUILD FLIGHT PLAN
BLOCK TIMES FLIGHT TIMES FUEL
IN . . . . . ON . . . . TAKEOFF . . . .
OUT . . . . . OFF . . . . LANDING . . . .
TOTAL . . . . . TOTAL . . . . BURNOFF . . . .
FLT REL IFR FGSL-05/YPAD-23 MACH 86 A/C B747-400 PMDG
FUEL TIME CORR TOGWT LDGWT AVG W/C
TAXI 002500 0010 . . . . 780782 451239 P023
DEST YPAD 329543 1525 . . . . ELEV. 20 FT
RESV 012300 0045 . . . .
ALTN 004878 0017 . . . . ALTN YPAG DIST 151
HOLD 008200 0030 . . . .
EXTRA 008489 0031 . . . . ZFW 417371 PAYLOAD 052845
TTL AT TO 363411 1728 . . . . DIST 7573
REQD 365911 1738 . . . . ETD
CLB BIAS 0.0% CRZ BIAS 0.0% DSC BIAS 0.0%
DEP BIAS 0 MIN 0 DIST 0 FUEL, ARR BIAS 0 MIN 500 FUEL
FGSL MOPOT OE 0115S 0320S 0624S 0928S ADMIS A406 DVL 1638S 1842S 2047S 2252S
2457S 2662S 2867S 2973S 3078S 3184S 3290S 3296S 32S02 32S07 PH Y19 AD YPAD/1525
M/H FL WIND ATC
TO NM AWY M/C TAS G/S ZT ACTME ETA ATA ACBO ABO REM AREM
N0246.5/E0936.9 142 CLB 243006 FCCC
TOC 080 DCT 141 332 329 00/16 00/16 .../... 0129/... 3504/...
N0236.2/E0946.9 138 330 087016 FCCC
MOPOT 000 DCT 140 482 456 00/00 00/16 .../... 0129/... 3504/...
N0132.1/E1134.5 121 330 091031 FCCC
OE 113.00 126 DCT 123 482 458 00/16 00/33 .../... 0205/... 3428/...
S0100.0/E1500.0 127 CLB 083030 FCCC
0115S 256 DCT 129 482 471 00/32 01/05 .../... 0358/... 3275/...
S0300.0/E2000.0 113 350 075012 FZZA
0320S 323 DCT 113 476 455 00/42 01/48 .../... 0565/... 3068/...
S0600.0/E2400.0 126 350 076018 ....
0624S 300 DCT 128 476 469 00/38 02/26 .../... 0752/... 2881/...
S0900.0/E2800.0 128 350 092006 ....
0928S 298 DCT 128 476 474 00/37 03/04 .../... 0922/... 2711/...
S1323.2/E3218.9 140 350 234017 FLFI
ADMIS 365 DCT 138 476 476 00/45 03/50 .../... 1121/... 2512/...
S1331.7/E3249.6 110 350 211017 FWLL
AXEBO 031 A406 108 476 480 00/03 03/54 .../... 1138/... 2495/...
S1334.6/E3259.3 113 350 211017 FWLL
DVL08 010 A406 111 476 480 00/01 03/55 .../... 1144/... 2489/...
S1343.0/E3328.6 113 350 211017 FWLL
DVL02 030 A406 111 476 479 00/03 03/59 .../... 1160/... 2473/...
S1348.7/E3348.4 110 350 231017 FWLL
DVL 114.90 020 A406 108 476 486 00/02 04/02 .../... 1171/... 2463/...
S1600.0/E3800.0 124 350 241016 FQBE
1638S 277 DCT 122 476 485 00/34 04/36 .../... 1296/... 2337/...
S1800.0/E4200.0 128 350 245021 ....
1842S 259 DCT 125 476 487 00/31 05/08 .../... 1413/... 2220/...
S2000.0/E4700.0 126 350 258031 ....
2047S 308 DCT 124 476 503 00/36 05/45 .../... 1548/... 2085/...
S2200.0/E5200.0 132 350 264039 ....
2252S 305 DCT 130 476 514 00/35 06/20 .../... 1670/... 1964/...
S2400.0/E5700.0 134 350 290053 FIMM
2457S 301 DCT 134 476 528 00/34 06/55 .../... 1786/... 1847/...
S2600.0/E6200.0 138 350 290053 FIMM
2662S 297 DCT 137 477 521 00/34 07/29 .../... 1902/... 1731/...
S2800.0/E6700.0 141 350 294046 FIMM
2867S 293 DCT 141 476 521 00/33 08/03 .../... 2011/... 1622/...
S2900.0/E7300.0 128 350 294046 FIMM
2973S 322 DCT 130 476 520 00/37 08/40 .../... 2127/... 1506/...
S3000.0/E7800.0 129 350 294046 YMMM
3078S 268 DCT 130 477 521 00/30 09/11 .../... 2224/... 1409/...
S3100.0/E8400.0 127 350 294046 YMMM
3184S 316 DCT 128 476 520 00/36 09/47 .../... 2338/... 1295/...
S3200.0/E9000.0 125 350 294046 YMMM
3290S 313 DCT 126 477 484 00/38 10/26 .../... 2459/... 1174/...
S3200.0/E9600.0 110 350 031015 YMMM
3296S 305 DCT 112 477 509 00/36 11/02 .../... 2572/... 1061/...
S3200.0/E10200.0 106 350 275047 YMMM
32S02 305 DCT 107 476 522 00/35 11/37 .../... 2682/... 0951/...
S3200.0/E10700.0 100 350 275047 YMMM
32S07 254 DCT 101 476 522 00/29 12/06 .../... 2773/... 0860/...
S3156.7/E11557.5 098 350 275047 YMMM
PH 113.70 455 DCT 098 476 510 00/53 13/00 .../... 2930/... 0704/...
S3237.6/E11847.8 108 350 283027 YMMM
HALIT 149 Y19 107 476 502 00/17 13/18 .../... 2982/... 0651/...
S3300.3/E12030.9 105 350 278037 YMMM
HECTO 090 Y19 105 476 512 00/10 13/28 .../... 3013/... 0620/...
S3311.8/E12150.5 099 350 280059 YMMM
STILE 068 Y19 099 476 534 00/07 13/36 .../... 3035/... 0598/...
S3342.6/E12500.0 102 350 280059 YMMM
HITCH 162 Y19 102 476 534 00/18 13/54 .../... 3088/... 0545/...
S3407.0/E12800.0 097 350 277030 YMMM
HOLLA 151 Y19 097 476 505 00/17 14/12 .../... 3140/... 0493/...
S3429.6/E13130.0 094 350 277030 YMMM
HUSKY 175 Y19 094 476 508 00/20 14/33 .../... 3196/... 0437/...
S3439.9/E13347.5 093 350 256038 YMMM
TOD 113 Y19 091 477 509 00/13 14/46 .../... 3233/... 0401/...
S3446.3/E13500.0 089 DSC 248034 YMMM
HYDRA 060 Y19 088 465 480 00/07 14/53 .../... 3248/... 0385/...
S3456.8/E13831.4 090 DSC 252038 YMMM
AD 116.40 173 Y19 087 301 331 00/31 15/25 .../... 3290/... 0343/...
S3456.7/E13831.7 00-5 115013 YMMM
YPAD 000 DCT 352 250 255 00/00 15/25 .../... 3295/... 0338/...
I really didn't add any details about the other fuel required for the flight plan because flight planners already take care of that for you.
Update:
I am approaching my POR of 32S02. I recalculated the flight plan with current winds and here is that new flight plan:
Code: Select all
FSBUILD FLIGHT PLAN
BLOCK TIMES FLIGHT TIMES FUEL
IN . . . . . ON . . . . TAKEOFF . . . .
OUT . . . . . OFF . . . . LANDING . . . .
TOTAL . . . . . TOTAL . . . . BURNOFF . . . .
FLT REL IFR GTI1040 FGSL-05/YPAD-23 MACH 86 A/C B747-400 PMDG
FUEL TIME CORR TOGWT LDGWT AVG W/C
TAXI 002500 0010 . . . . 776189 441764 P031
DEST YPAD 334425 1513 . . . . ELEV. 20 FT
RESV 004633 0017 . . . .
ALTN 004760 0017 . . . . ALTN YPAG DIST 151
HOLD 008000 0030 . . . .
EXTRA 007000 0026 . . . . ZFW 417371 PAYLOAD 052845
TTL AT TO 358818 1643 . . . . DIST 7577
REQD 361318 1653 . . . . ETD 0645
CLB BIAS 0.0% CRZ BIAS 0.0% DSC BIAS 0.0%
DEP BIAS 1 MIN 4 DIST 762 FUEL, ARR BIAS 0 MIN 500 FUEL
FGSL MOPOT OE 0115S 0320S 0624S 0928S ADMIS A406 DVL 1638S 1842S 2047S 2252S 2457S 2662S 2867S 2973S 3078S 3184S 3290S 3296S 32S02 32S07 PH Y19 AD YPAD/1513
M/H FL WIND ATC
TO NM AWY M/C TAS G/S ZT ACTME ETA ATA ACBO ABO REM AREM
N0301.0/E0923.1 143 CLB 237009 FCCC
TOC 064 DCT 141 283 278 00/14 00/14 0709/... 0111/... 3476/...
N0236.2/E0946.9 137 330 097022 FCCC
MOPOT 019 DCT 139 482 475 00/02 00/16 0711/... 0122/... 3465/...
N0132.1/E1134.5 119 CLB 059037 FCCC
OE 113.00 126 DCT 123 478 462 00/16 00/32 0727/... 0200/... 3387/...
S0100.0/E1500.0 125 350 057036 FCCC
0115S 256 DCT 129 476 466 00/32 01/05 0760/... 0360/... 3227/...
S0300.0/E2000.0 111 350 060029 FZZA
0320S 323 DCT 113 475 466 00/41 01/47 0842/... 0563/... 3025/...
S0600.0/E2400.0 126 350 035014 ....
0624S 300 DCT 128 477 478 00/37 02/25 0920/... 0746/... 2841/...
S0900.0/E2800.0 128 350 330004 ....
0928S 298 DCT 128 476 479 00/37 03/02 0957/... 0914/... 2673/...
S1323.2/E3218.9 140 CLB 227016 FLFI
ADMIS 365 DCT 138 476 478 00/45 03/48 1043/... 1113/... 2474/...
S1331.7/E3249.6 110 370 235020 FWLL
AXEBO 031 A406 108 475 487 00/03 03/52 1047/... 1130/... 2458/...
S1334.6/E3259.3 113 370 235020 FWLL
DVL08 010 A406 111 475 487 00/01 03/53 1048/... 1135/... 2452/...
S1343.0/E3328.6 113 370 235020 FWLL
DVL02 030 A406 111 475 487 00/03 03/57 1052/... 1151/... 2436/...
S1348.7/E3348.4 110 370 230019 FWLL
DVL 114.90 020 A406 108 475 486 00/02 03/59 1054/... 1161/... 2426/...
S1600.0/E3800.0 124 370 247015 FQBE
1638S 277 DCT 122 476 482 00/34 04/34 1129/... 1311/... 2276/...
S1800.0/E4200.0 127 370 265017 ....
1842S 259 DCT 125 476 493 00/31 05/05 1160/... 1448/... 2140/...
S2000.0/E4700.0 124 370 288030 ....
2047S 308 DCT 124 476 507 00/36 05/42 1237/... 1606/... 1981/...
S2200.0/E5200.0 131 370 278039 ....
2252S 305 DCT 130 475 515 00/35 06/17 1312/... 1744/... 1843/...
S2400.0/E5700.0 133 370 296045 FIMM
2457S 301 DCT 134 475 519 00/34 06/52 1347/... 1872/... 1715/...
S2600.0/E6200.0 137 370 296045 FIMM
2662S 297 DCT 137 475 517 00/34 07/27 1422/... 1998/... 1589/...
S2800.0/E6700.0 139 370 312049 FIMM
2867S 293 DCT 141 475 521 00/33 08/00 1455/... 2110/... 1478/...
S2900.0/E7300.0 127 370 312049 FIMM
2973S 322 DCT 130 476 517 00/37 08/38 1533/... 2227/... 1360/...
S3000.0/E7800.0 128 370 312049 YMMM
3078S 268 DCT 130 476 518 00/31 09/09 1604/... 2324/... 1263/...
S3100.0/E8400.0 125 370 312049 YMMM
3184S 316 DCT 128 476 517 00/36 09/46 1641/... 2439/... 1148/...
S3200.0/E9000.0 123 370 312049 YMMM
3290S 313 DCT 126 475 486 00/38 10/24 1719/... 2554/... 1033/...
S3200.0/E9600.0 108 370 009026 YMMM
3296S 305 DCT 112 476 536 00/34 10/59 1754/... 2658/... 0929/...
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// REDISPATCH POINT - 32S02 //
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
S3200.0/E10200.0 109 370 260084 YMMM
32S02 305 DCT 107 475 557 00/32 11/32 1827/... 2757/... 0830/...
S3200.0/E10700.0 103 370 260084 YMMM
32S07 254 DCT 101 475 557 00/27 11/59 1854/... 2839/... 0748/...
S3156.7/E11557.5 100 370 260084 YMMM
PH 113.70 455 DCT 098 475 539 00/50 12/50 1945/... 2986/... 0602/...
S3237.6/E11847.8 110 370 265053 YMMM
HALIT 149 Y19 107 475 524 00/17 13/07 2002/... 3035/... 0553/...
S3300.3/E12030.9 105 370 279043 YMMM
HECTO 090 Y19 105 475 517 00/10 13/17 2012/... 3064/... 0523/...
S3311.8/E12150.5 100 370 270057 YMMM
STILE 068 Y19 099 475 531 00/07 13/25 2020/... 3086/... 0501/...
S3342.6/E12500.0 103 370 270057 YMMM
HITCH 162 Y19 102 476 531 00/18 13/43 2038/... 3139/... 0449/...
S3407.0/E12800.0 097 370 279050 YMMM
HOLLA 151 Y19 097 475 524 00/17 14/00 2055/... 3188/... 0399/...
S3429.6/E13130.0 093 370 279050 YMMM
HUSKY 175 Y19 094 476 518 00/20 14/21 2116/... 3246/... 0341/...
S3440.1/E13331.7 092 370 267037 YMMM
TOD 100 Y19 091 476 511 00/11 14/33 2128/... 3278/... 0310/...
S3446.3/E13500.0 088 DSC 271036 YMMM
HYDRA 073 Y19 088 463 480 00/09 14/42 2137/... 3297/... 0291/...
S3456.8/E13831.4 090 DSC 254036 YMMM
AD 116.40 173 Y19 087 300 328 00/31 15/13 2208/... 3339/... 0248/...
S3456.7/E13831.7 00-3 094018 YMMM
YPAD 000 DCT 352 250 251 00/00 15/13 2208/... 3344/... 0243/...
This flight is working out well and little to no fuel issues. Let's look at a flight where we expect to cross 32S02 with 81.0 FOB. Normally we would automatically divert to YPPH because we can't legally be re-released to YPAD (FOB is less than re-release FOB). However there's one more trick we have up our sleeves thanks to the re-release flight plan.
For flights longer than 6 hours a destination alternate is required, regardless of weather conditions. When we departed FGSL to our RRAPT (YPPH) the flight was over 6 hours so we had to include an alternate of YPAG. At the re-release point, from RRAPT to YPAD, the ETE is approximately 3:30 which of course is less than 6 hours. We are no longer required to have an alternate as long as the weather is at least from 1 hour prior to 1 hour after our ETA: 2000' ceiling and 3 SM visibility. In the aviation world this is the "123 rule".
Let's look at the current METAR and TAF for YPAD to see if we can dump the alternate.
Code: Select all
YPAD 271800Z 00000KT CAVOK 04/03 Q1028 NOSIG
YPAD 271625Z 271818 04007KT CAVOK
FM02 22008KT CAVOK
FM09 12007KT CAVOK
FM15 03006KT CAVOK
When we departed FGSL we had on board 4878 lbs of fuel set aside to fly to our alternate. On the re-release flight plan we can move that 4878 lbs in alternate fuel to burnable fuel. The result is lowering the re-release fuel. Remember, the re-release fuel is enough fuel to fly to the destination, plus 10%, then fly to the most distant alternate and hold for 30 minutes. Here we are able to get rid of the fuel required to fly to the most distant alternate.
Now our re-release fuel would be 78.2 rather than 83.0. As you can see, crossing 32S02 with 81.0 FOB is now above the re-release fuel and we can continue, legally, to YPAD. Without using this trick of removing the alternate our re-release fuel would still be 83.0, above our actual FOB, we'd divert to YPPH.
You can see that this is just a numbers game played on paper.
I am planning to add re-relese capability to GCFM (the next generation of GCP) that will add a lot of realism and enhance the enjoyment of operating international flights.
Done:
Code: Select all
===== General =====
FS Version:
GCP Version: v2.2.5
Pilot Name: Justin Erickson
Pilot No: 1040
====== Flight Data ======
FS Date: 2008/08/26
Aircraft Title: Atlas Air N418 - 747-400F GE CF6 Engines
Flight No: GTI1040
FGSL - YPAD
Aircraft Type: 744F
Tail No: N418MC
Cargo: 52845
Departure: FGSL at 06:48z
Weight at Takeoff: 775698 (351851 Kg)
Takeoff Weather:
Visibility: 4
Wind: -165 at 4 kts
Temperature: 24C
Alternates-
Takeoff:
Enroute: YPPH
Destination: YPAD
Destination: YPAD at 21:27z
Weight on Landing: 438424 (198866 Kg)
Landing Weather:
Visibility: 60
Wind: 0 at 0 kts
Temperature: 4C
====== Fuel Summary ======
Out: 361120 (163801 Kg)
Off: 358316 (162529 Kg)
On: 21053 (9549 Kg)
In: 19544 (8865 Kg)
Taxi Out: 2804 (1272 Kg)
Burn: 337263 (152980 Kg)
Taxi In: 1509 (684 Kg)
Total Fuel: 341576 (154936 Kg)
======= Time Summary (Zulu) =======
Out: 06:48
Off: 06:55
On: 21:20
In: 21:27
Total Time: 14:39
====== Misc. Data ======
Max Sim Rate: 1
Touchdown Rate: -186
Distance: 7449
Stall Warning Activated: No
Overspeed Warning Activated: Yes
Comments:
Longest Flight Competition. RRAPT: YPPH
Fly safe!
Justin Erickson, Captain #1040
Chief Executive Officer
Globe Cargo PIREP (GCP) Developer
ceo-at-globecargova.org
Vatsim ID: 871725
Chief Executive Officer
Globe Cargo PIREP (GCP) Developer
ceo-at-globecargova.org
Vatsim ID: 871725
-
cyoo eddie
Re: Longest flight?
nice explanation Justin... 
but it is possible to add fuel in midflight to the pmdg747 unlike the rfp742
but it is possible to add fuel in midflight to the pmdg747 unlike the rfp742
-
chevol
- Member with over 30 posts
- Posts: 656
- Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2005 4:07 pm
- Location: Geneva, Switzerland
Re: Longest flight?
Very interesting explanation of re-releases! By the way, have we heard of Justin or is he swimming in the Indian ocean???
Luc Chevol-Voeltzel
pilot #1196
Geneva, Switzerland
pilot #1196
Geneva, Switzerland
Re: Longest flight?
Update posted on my detailed flight planning post.
Justin Erickson, Captain #1040
Chief Executive Officer
Globe Cargo PIREP (GCP) Developer
ceo-at-globecargova.org
Vatsim ID: 871725
Chief Executive Officer
Globe Cargo PIREP (GCP) Developer
ceo-at-globecargova.org
Vatsim ID: 871725
-
yoni63
Re: Longest flight?
cyoo eddie wrote:nice explanation Justin...
but it is possible to add fuel in midflight to the pmdg747 unlike the rfp742
But, if you check the Pirep closely, it will tell off on you if you did!
-
Maxthrust
Re: Longest flight?
Nice achievement, over 16 hours.. You still have a speeding ticket tho
Re: Longest flight?
I know, i'm sorry officer, I swear it was an accident.Maxthrust wrote:Nice achievement, over 16 hours.. You still have a speeding ticket tho
It happened after I unpaused this morning and updated the wx. There was a drastic wind change towards the tail so I disconnected the A/T and pushed the power all the way up to avoid a stall. Then I was working on my post above and forgot all about the power setting
Justin Erickson, Captain #1040
Chief Executive Officer
Globe Cargo PIREP (GCP) Developer
ceo-at-globecargova.org
Vatsim ID: 871725
Chief Executive Officer
Globe Cargo PIREP (GCP) Developer
ceo-at-globecargova.org
Vatsim ID: 871725
-
Erica Benedikty
Re: Longest flight?
nwadc10 wrote:I know, i'm sorry officer, I swear it was an accident.Maxthrust wrote:Nice achievement, over 16 hours.. You still have a speeding ticket tho
It happened after I unpaused this morning and updated the wx. There was a drastic wind change towards the tail so I disconnected the A/T and pushed the power all the way up to avoid a stall. Then I was working on my post above and forgot all about the power setting
Way to go on your flight!!!!! These flights are really challenging. Wait, are you saying you paused the flight and continued the next day? Was it online with vatsim?
Re: Longest flight?
Yup, that's correct. I paused for sleep because I got started on the flight later in the day than I had planned. I did not do this flight on Vatsim.Erica Benedikty wrote:nwadc10 wrote:I know, i'm sorry officer, I swear it was an accident.Maxthrust wrote:Nice achievement, over 16 hours.. You still have a speeding ticket tho
It happened after I unpaused this morning and updated the wx. There was a drastic wind change towards the tail so I disconnected the A/T and pushed the power all the way up to avoid a stall. Then I was working on my post above and forgot all about the power setting
Wait, are you saying you paused the flight and continued the next day? Was it online with vatsim?
Justin Erickson, Captain #1040
Chief Executive Officer
Globe Cargo PIREP (GCP) Developer
ceo-at-globecargova.org
Vatsim ID: 871725
Chief Executive Officer
Globe Cargo PIREP (GCP) Developer
ceo-at-globecargova.org
Vatsim ID: 871725
-
Maxthrust
Re: Longest flight?
Justin,nwadc10 wrote: I should have landed with no less than 12833 (10% from YPPH-YPAD, and 30 minutes of holding). Looks like the flight was a success.
I understand you did not include a minimum landing fuel in your fuel planning, and it's still legal. I couldn't find anything about the minimum landing fuel figure in our pilot manual, do we have any?
PMDG Manual states 24K lbs of MLF for International flights, do you think it's a real life figure?
-
DHG750R
- Member with over 30 posts
- Posts: 219
- Joined: Mon Feb 05, 2007 9:37 pm
- Location: New York
- Contact:
Re: Longest flight?
Atlas/Polar's company min landing fuel at your destination is 10,500kgs or 23,148lbs min landing fuel at your alternate is lowerMaxthrust wrote:Justin,nwadc10 wrote: I should have landed with no less than 12833 (10% from YPPH-YPAD, and 30 minutes of holding). Looks like the flight was a success.
I understand you did not include a minimum landing fuel in your fuel planning, and it's still legal. I couldn't find anything about the minimum landing fuel figure in our pilot manual, do we have any?
PMDG Manual states 24K lbs of MLF for International flights, do you think it's a real life figure?
Darrell Gordon
Globe Cargo 1557
Globe Cargo 1557