Earthquake relief flights?

Tsuru · Post by **Tsuru** » Tue Dec 28, 2004 12:03 pm

"Due to the overwhelming need for humanitarian aid in the area around the bay of Bengal in the wake of the 9.0-scale earthquake I think it's a good idea to increase the amount of flights to Chennai and Jakarta, and to arrange charter flights to airports in this area that are not currently in the Polar Air route structure but are suitable for our 747s on a temporary basis, like Colombo, Phuket, Rangoon, Male and Medan. Medical supplies, blankets, food, fuel, generators, communications and desalinisation equipment and tents are the main items that are needed over there. I collected some data and current NOTAMS for these airports. Flights out of current Polar Air hubs like Hong Kong, Chennai and Jakarta could be arranged, but beware that THERE MAY NOT BE ENOUGH FUEL AVAILABLE AT THE DESTINATION AIRPORTS FOR THE RETURN FLIGHT, so if you plan to ferry at least half the fuel you need for the return leg then that would be a very good idea. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif[/img] Some examples of flights: Chennai - Colombo Chennai - Male Jakarta - Medan Hong Kong - Phuket - Bangkok (because of runway length) Hong Kong - Rangoon - Bangkok (because of runway length) Colombo, Sri Lanka (CMB/VCBI) <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>Airport name : Colombo Runway Length : 11050 ft. Runway Elevation : 29 ft. City : Colombo Country : Sri Lanka Country Abbrev. : LK World Area Code : 711 GMT Offset : -5.5 Longitude : 79° 51' 0"" E Latitude : 6° 56' 0"" N</div> A0271/04 NOTAMR A0265/04 Q) VCCC/QCTXX/I/NBO/AE/000/999 A) VCBI B ) 0412280400 C) 0501020400EST E) TAR TAKEN OFF FOR MAINT.THE FOLLOWING RADAR SERVICES WILL CONTINUE TO BE PROVIDED BY COLOMBO DIRECTOR USING LONG RANGE SSR INFORMATION. 1.RADAR SURVEILLANCE OF TRANSPONDER EQUIPPED ACFT. 2.RADAR SEPERATION FOR IDENTIFIED TRAFFIC. 3.RADAR GUIDANCE TO BASE LEG RWY 22/04,AT 2500 FT, FOR 10NM FINAL TO ENABLE ACFT TO MAKE THEIR OWN TURN ON TO FINAL FOR ILS OR VISUAL APPROACH. LATERAL SEPERATION MINIMA - 8NM UPPER/LOWER LIMIT - FL150/ALT 2500FT FREQ - 132.4MHZ 4.RADAR MONITORED APPROACHES FOR ACFT CARRYING OUT SELF POSITIONING FOR FINAL, SUBJECT TO TRAFFIC. NOTE:DESCENT BELOW 2500FT WILL BE AT PILOTS DISCRETION. A0272/04 NOTAMN Q) VCCC/QXXXX/IV/NBO/A/000/999 A) VCBI B ) 0412281045 C) 0501140500EST E) SHEDULE ACFT MOVEMENTS MAY EXPECT DLA DUE PARKING OF ACFT BRINGING HUMANITARIAN RELIEF AID Male, Maldives (MLE/VRMM) <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>Airport name : Male Runway Length : 9318 ft. Runway Elevation : 4 ft. City : Male Country : Maldives Country Abbrev. : MV World Area Code : 750 GMT Offset : -5.0 Longitude : 73° 29' 0"" E Latitude : 4° 12' 0"" N</div> A0189/04 NOTAMN Q) VRMF/QILAS/I/NBO/A/000/999/ A) VRMM B ) 0412261700 C) 0412282359EST E) RWY36 ILS LLZ U/S.ALL ARR AND DEP ACFT EXP ATC DLA A0190/04 NOTAMN Q) VRMF/QNMAS/IV/BO/AE/000/999/ A) VRMM B ) 0412261705 C) 0412282359EST E) VOR/DME U/S. ALL ARR AND DEP ACFT EXP ATC DLA A0191/04 NOTAMN Q) VRMF/NBAS/IV/BO/AE/000/999/ A) VRMM B ) 0412261708 C) 0412280700EST E) 'ML' NDB U/S. ALL ARR AND DEP ACFT EXP ATC DLA A0195/04 NOTAMR A0192/04 Q) VRMF/QNBAS/IV/BO/AE/000/999/ A) VRMM B ) 0412280340 C) 0412291300EST E) 'ML' NDB U/S. ALL ARR AND DEP ACFT EXP ATC DLA A0196/04 NOTAMR A0194/04 Q) VRMF/QNAAS/IV/NBO/AE/000/999/ A) VRMM B ) 0412280353 C) 0412311300EST E) DUE TO THE UNAVAILABILITY OF RDO NAV AIDS AT MALE' INTL AIRPORT NGT OPS ARE RESTRICTED TO DEP AND HUMANITARIAN FLT ONLY Medan, Indonesia (MES/WIMM) <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>Airport name : Polania Airport Runway Length : 9715 ft. Runway Elevation : 89 ft. City : Medan Country : Indonesia Country Abbrev. : ID World Area Code : 832 GMT Offset : -7.0 Longitude : 98° 41' 0"" E Latitude : 3° 34' 0"" N</div> NO NOTAMS Phuket, Thailand (HKT/VTSP) <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>Airport name : Phuket Runway Length : 8200 ft. Runway Elevation : 69 ft. City : Phuket Country : Thailand Country Abbrev. : TH World Area Code : 782 GMT Offset : -7.0 Longitude : 98° 19' 0"" E Latitude : 8° 8' 0"" N</div> A2688/04 NOTAMN Q) VTBB/QMPLC/IV/BO/A/000/999/0806N09818E005 A) VTSP B ) 0412250100 C) 0501251000 E) ACFT STAND NR17 AND NR20 CLSD Rangoon, Myanmar (RGN/VYYY) <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>Airport name : Mingaladon Airport Runway Length : 8100 ft. Runway Elevation : 109 ft. City : Yangon Country : Myanmar (Burma) Country Abbrev. : MM World Area Code : 706 GMT Offset : -6.5 Longitude : 96° 8' 0"" E Latitude : 16° 51' 10"" N</div> NO NOTAMS"

Niki · Post by **Niki** » Tue Dec 28, 2004 7:04 pm

Super idea! I hope we can help the people in those regions! Niki

Murray_1167 · Post by **Murray_1167** » Tue Dec 28, 2004 9:39 pm

"I'm sorry but I find your idea to be in bad taste. If you were one of the people affected by this or any other disaster, I doubt if you would be amused. I realize that you did not mean to be insensitive but I am not happy with your suggestion. If the majority of you here think this way please let me know and I will look for (virtual) employment elsewhere. No hard feelings intended! I'm just not built that way. "

BarryTheAviator · Post by **BarryTheAviator** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 5:58 am

"<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Murray_1167 @ Dec 29 2004, 01:39 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'>I'm sorry but I find your idea to be in bad taste. If you were one of the people affected by this or any other disaster, I doubt if you would be amused. [right][snapback]2617[/snapback][/right] </div> I have to agree - there is a line betwen what is, after all said and done, a game, pastime, hobby, whatever and the real world. They are real people who have died and are still dying in their tens of thousands. This is not the time or place to make it into an ""add-on"" for a hobby. Do it if you want but I will have no part of it., I know this sounds very judgemental but that is exactly how I meant it to be."

Tsuru · Post by **Tsuru** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 6:19 am

"You know what? Forget about it. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/mellow.gif[/img] <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>I know this sounds very judgemental</div>Personally, I think judgemental is not the right word, Barry. Hypocritical would a better one. I thought it was a good idea besides doing my thing and making a donation to the Red Cross. In all honesty, what more can you expect people like us to do about this? This is intended as a gesture of good will and a way to deal with the frustration of not being able to do anything more about this besides throwing money at these poor people. Because, dear Barry and Murray, that is what a hobby is. A means of dealing with frustrations by distracting yourself. Yes, what about if I were one of those people struggling to stay alive after losing all of my personal posessions? I think I'd be a little too busy worrying about other, more important things like how I'm going to make a living after all of this blows over rather than wondering what some bloko in Europe likes to do to vent his frustrations. I thought this was a good idea to at least bring the pilot group closer together, but the way I see it now there are too many people in it who apparently just have to place hypocritical and totally irrelevant moral objections with everything they do (and don't) in their daily lives. Don't get me wrong, I also have my reservations with other pastimes like playing games that glorify war and killing one's fellow man, but by all means please be realistic here people. "

Shermann · Post by **Shermann** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 6:59 am

"<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>Personally, I think judgemental is not the right word, Barry. Hypocritical would a better one.</div> I agree "

BarryTheAviator · Post by **BarryTheAviator** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 7:55 am

"<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Shermann @ Dec 29 2004, 10:59 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'>I agree [right][snapback]2621[/snapback][/right] </div> Hypocritical implies I do one thing and practice another - evidence please. We all have our moral point of view, you may regard me as judgemental - I accept that, but I think hypocritical based on zero evidence is a bit strong. Before this gets too personal and/or infringes others beliefs let us agree to disagree and carry on with our hobby. I wil join you all in donating what I reasonably can to relief via Red + etc. What a dreadful end to 2004."

Tsuru · Post by **Tsuru** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 8:22 am

"<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(BarryTheAviator @ Dec 29 2004, 12:55 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'>Hypocritical implies I do one thing and practice another - evidence please. We all have our moral point of view, you may regard me as judgemental - I accept that, but I think hypocritical based on zero evidence is a bit strong. Before this gets too personal and/or infringes others beliefs let us agree to disagree and carry on with our hobby. I wil join you all in donating what I reasonably can to relief via Red + etc. What a dreadful end to 2004. [right][snapback]2623[/snapback][/right] </div>Evidence is in bold. You haven't donated yet but yet you have the nerve to say my initiative is immoral. If you want to do some good please save your breath for the people who are making money off this and the lowlifes who are looting the stricken villages and towns this very minute. But I suppose that's a lot harder to do than just tearing to pieces someone elses idea on an internet forum in the comfort of your own home."

jcboliveira · Post by **jcboliveira** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 8:39 am

"This is a touchy subject. Personally I believe that an online fly to the region with remarks in how the people can help could be a good thing, could help raising funds. However I?m sitting in my office in a nice chair I don?t have any moral grounds to even consider what is right and what is wrong. Since I don?t have the courage to make what is right: Help as a volunteer in a Non governmental organization I can only do one thing, give a monetary contribute. The true heroes are the people that go to the field and help. MD, nurses or simple persons that hold a child in their arms. These ones, together with the victims, have the right to judge if an act of doing a fly to the region is proper or not. Not me sitting in a nice room trying to make peace with my soul by reaching the VISA and entering in the UNICEF site. Regards"

james67 · Post by **james67** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 8:51 am

"Hello everyone... I agree that the way that this can be viewed is up to the individual. If it offends you, disregard it... For what it is worth, there are MANY virtual airlines out there that fly DART missions (Disaster Relief) and who already have these missions posted regarding the tsunami. For some people, doing what they can in the real world is obviously important, but for others a ""simulated"" sense of flying relief may be a way to cope... who knows. Either way, I don't think anyone should rush to judgement over flying a simulated disaster relief mission... After all, there are REAL world problems out there that demand more attention than what I've already given this post.... (not to be taken the wrong way) Jim PAC1141"

BarryTheAviator · Post by **BarryTheAviator** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 8:51 am

"<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tsuru @ Dec 29 2004, 12:22 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'>Evidence is in bold. You haven't donated yet but yet you have the nerve to say my initiative is immoral. [right][snapback]2624[/snapback][/right] </div> 1. You have no personal knowledge of what I have done, intend to do or my personal circumstances. 2. I did not say your initiative was immoral - I do not think it is - I think it was in bad taste. I would point out that no mention was made in your inital post of any real aid - it was purely concerned with setting up ""virtual"" flights to the Indian Ocean rim. I made NO judgement on what you may or may not have done just on what you actually wrote. This subject could get out of hand - I will make no further comment or reply. "

Post by **esurfman** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 11:12 am

"I personally think that flying aircraft for virtual aircraft might be a way to show that we understantd the terrible thing that happened over there. As far as bad taste, should we ban WWll games out of respect for all the soldiers and civilians that died? I think Yannic was just making a suggestion and had no disrespect for anybody. Let's all take a deep breath and relax."

Davest · Post by **Davest** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 4:21 pm

My opinion would be setup the flights but more importantly make a donation as well. X amount of dollars for each leg flown in real money to the Red Cross. Send the money to Ralph and he can make the donation on the behalf of all of us as a community of Globe Cargo.

Murray_1167 · Post by **Murray_1167** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 6:48 pm

"Like I said above. Put yourself in the shoes of anyone involved in the actual disaster and then ask yourself this question... ""Does the fact that a group of individuals, sitting at home at their computers (playing what is a game), pretending to bring me relieve in their pretend airplanes, bother me? Can you not see how this would be preceived as ""maybe"" a little twisted. Please, just try and see it from the perspective of an individual that is dying, or watching his dead family member lying on the ground. Does this make more sense. This is the ""reality"" of the situation. What you or I do in the privacy of our home, as individuals, is no concern of mine. But I WILL not belong to a group that thinks that this sort of ""playing"" is permissable. There is enough ""real"" pain and suffering in the world to go around. I don't believe there is any need to treat any of it as part of a ""game"". NONE of what I have said should be taken as an attack on anyone and what they believe in. I am not God. I am NOT your judge. I don't even know any of you. I assume none of you are judgeing me, for the same reason. I simply want to leave the suffering and pain of real people in the real world, so if I desire, I can come to the virtual world to escape. What I do in response to the real world is my private business... and your's as well. Thank you all for reading and trying to understand my thoughts. I feel a GREAT kinship towards you all... lets face it, we are brothers with a very common interest. Flying (for HOURS) virtual planes! I personally have NO ONE in my life that understands my hobby... all of you do! [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif[/img] "

nharwood · Post by **nharwood** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 8:11 pm

"You know something? It's a shame that it takes something like this to get people to actually post on these forums. In the past 2 days this topic has had more posts than I've seen since I joined a few weeks ago. In my humble opinion Murray, Barry and Tsuru are all equally noble in your own ways. Murray and Barry you seem to respect a tragic loss of life through strict and quiet reverence while Tsuru is respecting the same through honorable action and remembrance. I think Davest's idea is the best way to both respect and pay tribute at the same time."