" Ralph, many thanks for your explanation! I think I see the light at the end of the tunnel now. <!--emo&:)--><!--endemo--> The destination is just that... destination. We must find (follow) the chosen flight (number) through the different area schedules, match the days/times and eventually the last leg will show up terminating the flight at destination which is stated where I began my selection. In Ian's example, SYD-LGG, LGG is the destination, but the first leg obviously goes through, or close to, HKG. Phew! I feel... well, I won't say old! <!--emo&:rolleyes:--><!--endemo--> Phil, my friend... we do not give up! <!--emo&:P--><!--endemo--> I'll start from scratch and trace me a route to my desired destination. Time to fetch my world atlas... "
Last edited by Jure on Mon Jul 19, 2004 11:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
" Ralph, Thanks for the understanding and support. I guess its just as frustrating for you guys' trying to put everything together and keep all us crew members happy into the bargin !! I'm all for realism, so don't defer from the real life operations if it can be at all avoided. Don't suppose we know any one, who knows someone who works in the sheduling dept for polar and could throw some light on the subject ?? I'll try to find something to bid for before close of play on the 20th, even if it ends up being one leg of a mutli legged affair........ Keep the faith Ralph, don't let your principles be moved for a quick win !! I have been simming since the late 70's and todate I have to say that RFP is the best I have seen for the realism that mirrors real life systems and operation so far... I'll try and take a little more water with my drink in future or take up the worry beads in order to keep the lid on the pressure cooker that sits inside my head !! Phil <!--emo&^_^--><!--endemo--> "
" Thanks for seeing our side of things too. It is going to be frustrationg for the next few weeks but I really do feel that once the pressure is off we can resolve many of these issues. <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I'll try and take a little more water with my drink <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Hey, one short reminder, no drinking on the job. <!--emo&--><!--endemo--> I hope that's airline coffee that you are watering down? Some of our flight engineers didn't pass the course on brewing coffee. Check out the freighter galley below. "
" Ralph.....No dangers here of drinking on the job !! Have been tee total since Sept last year when I managed to break my skull into five peices and fracture two discs in my lower spine, then two days after leaving hospital i started to lose fluid from around the brain, so back to hospital we went for more treatment !!! I haven't worked since the accident, but my employers have been superb in supporting my fight back to health...using the pc for things such as flight simulation has helped me regain alot of my cognotive processes that took a nose dive after the accident, I go to rehab twice a week and hopefully might return to work at the start of Oct!!! To anyone who might read this, all I will say is that none of us know when it will be our time to depart this earth, so ensure you live each day to the full and tell your loved ones how much you love them..it will be too late when they've gone... I guess for me it was alucky escape and maybe the good lord decided at the last moment that I could spend more time down here with my family and friends.... Phil <!--emo&:)--><!--endemo--> "
" Guys..... I wouldn't get too wound up about the schedules if I were you. There's a number on things you must bare in mind whilst looking at the routes, firstly, all the timings are LOCAL, meaning just that. Don't get confused about the times, factor in the approximate time difference from airport to airport. Secondly, and most importantly, this is a Cargo schedule.... not a passenger schedule. For the most part, cargo only goes one way..... there is no return flight... (unless it's broken!) When viewing the schedule, like Ralph has says, you will fly from point A to Point B via several stops along the way, rather like a bus trip into town. Along the way people will get on and off before you get to your destination. The bus then terminates and that's the end of the ride..... for the cargo at least! As a Polar 1st Officer explained in the DVD, he goes all over the place..... it is certainly NOT a back and forth trip.... He may be rostered to fly from A to B, then catch a commercial flight from B to C where he then flies another cargo flight from C to D via a few more stops. He then gets another commercial flight from D to E to pick up another cargo flight and so on and so on. This may go on for 2 weeks or more before he gets back home to point A. In our case, your assigned route might take you from Sydney to GOT (PO168) via several stops over several legs. Once you get to GOT have a few beers and a decent rest... you will NOT be flying cargo back to Sydney, you will be catching a commercial passenger flight back instead and doing the same flight the following week or month or whatever you've elected to fly. The beauty of all this is that you're not flying JFK to EHAM, EHAM to JFK, JFK to EHAM and back for a month solid. It's far more interesting in my book. As for trying to find out whereabouts you stop along your route, have a look at all the airports with in the region and beyond to see if your flight no appears, for example on PO168, if you look at HKG, you'll see that LAX is listed as the first Place, and then ICN, GOT and finally LGG. The times listed are local to that airport so GOT is the last stop (0850 on Wedensday). Now if you look at the other hubs within the Groupe 2, there's no listing at NRT for PO168, (so it doesn't go there), it's listed at ICN as leaving ICN at 2215 for LAX, (the LAX arrival time is the same as that listed in HKG). Now if we check TPE (although it wasn't listed on the HKG page,) PO168 IS listed as leaving at 1645 and going to LAX for 1715. The only reason I can think of why certain places aren't listed on each airport is that they don't load cargo for that specific destination. In the case of PO168, in HKG they load the plane with cargo for LAX, ICN GOT and LGG. They do not load cargo for TPE, however it stops there for cargo to be loaded for LAX only. Likewise with SYD, they are only loading cargo for LGG and not the other stops along the route. I'm sorry if it seems a bit long winded but I hope you can make sense of it. It just means that you really have to check all the airports for your flight # otherwise you might miss a stop and there will be a very angry loadmaster waiting on the ramp with a load of cargo and no plane arrives.... not good for business really... Good luck flying your routes, remember it's supposed to be fun! Ian Shawcross Asia / Australia Region. "
" So if I understand this correctly, PO46 out of MIA stops at PIK @1355+1,AMS@1825+1,NRT@1930+1,ICN@2345+1 and finally onto HKG@1250+2??? I'm hoping this is how I have it figured, I am definitely confused, not so much as to the route and stops but the flight numbers themselves. If you look at the departing flights for some of the airports listed above the times will match but not the flight numbers. I know once the big light bulb comes on inside this will be a walk in the park but please someone help me find the switch! <!--emo&:blink:--><!--endemo--> "
" Why not just make it so that when you click on a certain flight number on the schedule, it takes you to a page with the stops for that flight, rather then have everyone jumping around the schedules trying to find the links of the chain? Have everything in one place for each flight. "
" Steve, You're getting the hang of it and almost there..... Remember to check ALL the Hubs. In your example, PO46 does go to the hubs you've listed yes..... but checking the Group 1 airports you'll find that PO46 originates at VCP at 1450 on THURSDAY and goes to SCL then on to MIA where it arrives at 0400 on Friday. (Presumably a crew change) then departs at 0615 to ATL then onto ORD. TPE is also another stop in the Asia region before it finally terminates in HKG 2 days after it set off from MIA but 3 days after it left VCP I'm sure you'll get the hang of it, just remember to check all the hubs..... on PO46, the big picture is it starts in South America, goes to North America then on to Europe and then on to Asia where it Terminates in HKG. It then leaves HKG as a different flight on Sunday (either PO 128, 148 or 268) going somewhere different. I hope this helps. <!--emo&:unsure:--><!--endemo--> Ian "
" Ok, here's my take at the schedules... Flight PO420 originating at PIK, saturday, @17:30 to BOM. 1. leg - to LGG although not listed on PIK sheet, flights go to DXB, BOM and MAA at app. correct times. Departure from LGG to DXB on Saturday @22:00 2. leg Arrival at DXB Sunday @6:30, departing to BOM Sunday @8:30 3. leg Arrival at BOM Sunday @13:00, departing @15:00 to ??? Trouble here... possible destinations are DXB, LGG and ATL or a short hop to MAA, where there are flights listed @19:00 to DXB, LGG, TPE Let's take BOM first. - if I choose to go to ATL or JFK the flight seems to terminate there. - if I choose to return to LGG, the flight terminates there, too. Or maybe not, on monday @21:00 there's a PO420 back to DXB! - if I choose DXB, arrival @21:30 there's a PO421 flight to LGG. Hmm... change of flight No.? If I proceed to MAA, situation is similar. - DXB, LGG and instead of JFK, a flight to TPE, where it also seems to terminate. My first question (if I am on the track with all of this) would be: what to do at BOM (or MAA)? Second: How does one know where a flight in fact originates? Third: How to figure out a change in flight No? I mean, it could basically change to any other flight No with a host of new destinations. If anyone can help me with this, I would appreciate it very much. <!--emo&:)--><!--endemo--> "
Last edited by Jure on Tue Jul 20, 2004 9:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
" Thanks Ian that helps a lot, it's confusing but not impossible. I think I am going to print every hubs routes out and just pick them apart, it may make it easier. Jure I tried to follow you on that one and became just as confused as you are. Are PO420/410 and PO420/412 two seperate flights leaving on different days? "
" Steve, yes, it seems so... 420/410 leaves PIK on saturday, while 420/412 leaves PIK on sunday. You will notice that there is no flight out of DXB or BOM on monday when you arrive there, should you take the sunday flight out of PIK. But, there are flights (PO420) on tuesday, so you wait over in DXB for one day?... more confussion? <!--emo&:)--><!--endemo--> "
" Jure, I've had a look at your flight PO420..... You've picked a tricky one there! Not helped by the fact that there's a few mistakes on the Schedules (as best as I can make out.... eg the lack of adding a +1 day on some of the sheets and wrong flight number which has confused us! Also TPE is a mistake in N America... it should be ATL!) NOW things become clearer..... The route as I make out ORIGINATES in JFK on Friday 2230 and routes as follows: HUB ETA / ETD DAY JFK 2230 FRI PIK 1530 / 1730 SAT LGG 2000 / 2200 SAT DXB 0630 / 0830 SUN BOM 1300 / 1500 SUN MAA 1700 / 1900 SUN DXB 2130 / 2300 SUN ****Wrong flt # (PO4211)*** LGG 0400 / 1115 MON *** Wrong Flt # (PO413)*** ATL 1430 / ------ MON Terminates as flt PO420 and leaves as PO414/512/702 Thats the best I can make out..... obviousl there would be crew changes at PIK on Sat, DXB on Sun (DXB crew would fly DXB BOM MAA DXB) another crew change for DXB LGG and final crew change for LGG ATL. (I think) Hope this helps....... <!--emo&:blink:--><!--endemo--> Ian "
" Ian, thank you very much! Indeed, things are much clearer now! I must print the original Polar Air schedules and compare them with the ones on this site. So, the only question that remains is, can I still fly PO420 and start out of PIK? Or should I start at JFK? The reason I chose PO420 is that I am somewhat familiar with the route having flown to Dubai for Atlas Air. By the way, my route terminates at ATL, right? I mean, when the flight No. changes, then it is considered as another route picked up by someone else? "
<!--endemo--> The destination is just that... destination. We must find (follow) the chosen flight (number) through the different area schedules, match the days/times and eventually the last leg will show up terminating the flight at destination which is stated where I began my selection. In Ian's example, SYD-LGG, LGG is the destination, but the first leg obviously goes through, or close to, HKG. Phew! I feel... well, I won't say old! <!--emo&:rolleyes:-->
<!--endemo--> Phil, my friend... we do not give up! <!--emo&:P-->
<!--endemo--> I'll start from scratch and trace me a route to my desired destination. Time to fetch my world atlas... "
<!--endemo--> "
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<!--endemo--> I hope that's airline coffee that you are watering down? Some of our flight engineers didn't pass the course on brewing coffee. Check out the freighter galley below. "
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<!--endemo--> Ian "